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+--- Thread: AVL / Real Time Information (/showthread.php?tid=1079)
AVL / Real Time Information - Adrian - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 8:39 am)Dan Good job other hardware can be used to ensure that all vehicles can be traced! We've already discussed Arriva's system for real time information being less than ideal - Go North East won't have this problem.
I'll be quite interested to see it in action. It's bound to be an improvement on the Siemens AVL system they purchased...
A criticism I have of the Arriva live map is that when a vehicle (presumably) loses data signal, which happens a lot in rural Durham, it disappears from the map completely. It should display an estimated location with a different icon colour instead, until it picks data signal back up. I also think the live map should indicate zone boundaries, and I'd hope GNE's solution would say shade different parts of the map different colours, depending on the Buzzfare zone.
RE: Customer Service thread - citaro5284 - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 8:35 am)palatine3833 they certainly have a few benefits over the ERG model which GNE have (including GPS that works)
Apart from the GPS (in fact GNE ticket machines are starting to get fitted with sim's this weekend for AVL), what other benefits do the Parkeon machines offer compared to Vix?
RE: Customer Service thread - tyresmoke - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 9:24 am)aureolin I'll be quite interested to see it in action. It's bound to be an improvement on the Siemens AVL system they purchased...
A criticism I have of the Arriva live map is that when a vehicle (presumably) loses data signal, which happens a lot in rural Durham, it disappears from the map completely. It should display an estimated location with a different icon colour instead, until it picks data signal back up. I also think the live map should indicate zone boundaries, and I'd hope GNE's solution would say shade different parts of the map different colours, depending on the Buzzfare zone.
The Arriva map can do this, indeed I've just been looking at mine and the buses that are not being tracked (for whatever reason) are displaying an estimated location with a grey icon instead of green.
RE: Customer Service thread - citaro5284 - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 9:35 am)tyresmoke The Arriva map can do this, indeed I've just been looking at mine and the buses that are not being tracked (for whatever reason) are displaying an estimated location with a grey icon instead of green.
Scott, is it estimated or is it just the scheduled time from the timetable?
RE: Customer Service thread - Dan - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 9:35 am)tyresmoke The Arriva map can do this, indeed I've just been looking at mine and the buses that are not being tracked (for whatever reason) are displaying an estimated location with a grey icon instead of green.
I have the setting disabled to only show live buses, and find that aureolin is right - they often don't re-appear as grey - and have found that once you exit the application and go back on it, it does pick up these buses with grey icons.
RE: Customer Service thread - Adrian - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 9:35 am)tyresmoke The Arriva map can do this, indeed I've just been looking at mine and the buses that are not being tracked (for whatever reason) are displaying an estimated location with a grey icon instead of green.
The estimation is incorrect though. It either freezes completely, or it jumps back or forward, to what it's position *would* be if it was working to timetable. If you watch what the X1 tends to do between Bowburn and Durham you'll see what I mean. I think the grey icons are just buses that aren't tracked altogether, so again, just follows what the position would be according to timetable.
Edit: Have a quick look at the two X1s on the A177 at Bowburn now.
RE: Customer Service thread - tyresmoke - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 9:39 am)citaro5284 Scott, is it estimated or is it just the scheduled time from the timetable?
Yeah it'll be from the timetabled times.
RE: Customer Service thread - Dan - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 9:44 am)tyresmoke Yeah it'll be from the timetabled times.
I hadn't realised that.
So if it's running 20 minutes late when it is being tracked, loses signal, does the grey blob suggest it's on time and jumps to where it would be if it wasn't 20 minutes late?
RE: Customer Service thread - tyresmoke - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 9:45 am)Dan I hadn't realised that.
So if it's running 20 minutes late when it is being tracked, loses signal, does the grey blob suggest it's on time and jumps to where it would be if it wasn't 20 minutes late?
Yeah though it doesn't suggest it is on time, just displays "this bus isn't currently being tracked"
RE: Customer Service thread - Dan - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 9:46 am)tyresmoke Yeah though it doesn't suggest it is on time, just displays "this bus isn't currently being tracked"
FAO citaro5284 - if, for whatever reason, GNE's buses lose signal when they have this technology, will it be estimated rather than just go off the timetable?
Clearly, whilst it's good Arriva make it clear that the bus isn't being tracked, it goes without saying that it isn't ideal if a bus is running 20 minutes late, and then looks like it's on-time when it can't be tracked.
RE: Customer Service thread - citaro5284 - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 9:51 am)Dan FAO citaro5284 - if, for whatever reason, GNE's buses lose signal when they have this technology, will it be estimated rather than just go off the timetable?
I have seen a demo of it and Vix have suggested that their system estimates based on last point rather than just going to a timetable location. I think the main difference is the Vix system uses the vehicles running board rather than trip numbers alone, so an example is if a bus is running 10 minutes late into a terminus and it is changing route/trip number, and the running board says he has 10 mins layover, the system will then say he is going to depart on time, however if running 12 late, it will say he is departing 2L.
I think the Arriva system just looks at trip numbers only, so until a driver keys in a new journey number, it assumes the vehicle is on time. And of course you should never assume as it makes an ass out of u and me
RE: Customer Service thread - VolvoMarkII - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 9:59 am)citaro5284 I have seen a demo of it and Vix have suggested that their system estimates based on last point rather than just going to a timetable location. I think the main difference is the Vix system uses the vehicles running board rather than trip numbers alone, so an example is if a bus is running 10 minutes late into a terminus and it is changing route/trip number, and the running board says he has 10 mins layover, the system will then say he is going to depart on time, however if running 12 late, it will say he is departing 2L.
I think the Arriva system just looks at trip numbers only, so until a driver keys in a new journey number, it assumes the vehicle is on time. And of course you should never assume as it makes an ass out of u and me
The Arriva system does work on the bus board, so it should provide delay information for subsequent journeys when using the planner - even if the trip hasn't commenced yet, but the bus that is due to operate it is somewhere near to completing the trip before hand.
Not sure if it calculates delay with layover offset though.
RE: Customer Service thread - citaro5284 - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 11:42 am)VolvoMarkII The Arriva system does work on the bus board, so it should provide delay information for subsequent journeys when using the planner - even if the trip hasn't commenced yet, but the bus that is due to operate it is somewhere near to completing the trip before hand.
Not sure if it calculates delay with layover offset though.
If it uses running boards, how does it not show correctly when lets say the X5 is running late into Haymarket which then goes out on the X4, but when standing at the Haymarket it is showing the X4 been on time, until the driver changes the route/trip number?
RE: Customer Service thread - Adrian - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 11:42 am)VolvoMarkII The Arriva system does work on the bus board, so it should provide delay information for subsequent journeys when using the planner - even if the trip hasn't commenced yet, but the bus that is due to operate it is somewhere near to completing the trip before hand.
Not sure if it calculates delay with layover offset though.
It doesn't though? There's a 24 on the map at present that's showing 20 minutes late heading into Durham. It'll be the one that was due in at 1317. That's meant to go back out at 1322, but it's not showing on the map? Inactive or otherwise?
RE: Customer Service thread - tyresmoke - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 12:40 pm)aureolin It doesn't though? There's a 24 on the map at present that's showing 20 minutes late heading into Durham. It'll be the one that was due in at 1317. That's meant to go back out at 1322, but it's not showing on the map? Inactive or otherwise?
The trip planner does show it as going back out late though...
RE: Customer Service thread - cbma06 - 26 Jul 2014
Ive gived up using the Arriva live map App.
Since their last updated the App, the bus icon only moves when the App updates every 1 or 2 minutes ish, which is not real time. sometimes the icon says the bus has just arrived at peterlee bus station and next thing I know the bus has just gone past my house, Arriva needs to sort it out, before their updated the App you could see the bus icon moving along the road.
RE: Customer Service thread - Dan - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 12:43 pm)tyresmoke The trip planner does show it as going back out late though...
It will now, given that it's actually on that run..?
RE: Customer Service thread - Adrian - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 12:43 pm)tyresmoke The trip planner does show it as going back out late though...
But if I'm waiting at say Sherburn Village for the 24 to Sunderland, it's of absolutely no use to me. Your average customer isn't going to know (or care) about trip numbers, running boards, interworking, etc. They're going to see nothing more than that their bus hasn't arrived, is almost 20 mins late, and it isn't showing on the live map...
RE: Customer Service thread - Dan - 26 Jul 2014
(26 Jul 2014, 12:48 pm)Dan It will now, given that it's actually on that run..?
See screenies below.
We can see that service 23 which is due to arrive into Hartlepool is currently expected to be arriving in 9 minutes late (14:56) - the service makes its return journey back to Sunderland at 14:51, yet on the Trip Planner, my bus is shown as running on time.
What would be good is if this could be updated in real time (which it would, if it were based off the running boards), and it would show a 5 minute delay to that service too.
Obviously, if the trip has already started (as in your example above Scott - it was twenty minutes late, and you took your screenie twenty minutes after it was due out), we can see this - but not before the trip has actually started... This may be the time when people are planning their journeys ahead of their day out.
RE: Customer Service thread - Andreos1 - 26 Jul 2014
Just to stick my two penneth in - why can the toc's have the system working like it has done for however many years, but bus operators seemingly can't get it right.