Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - Printable Version +- North East Buses (https://northeastbuses.co.uk/forums) +-- Forum: Local Bus Scene (https://northeastbuses.co.uk/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=1) +--- Forum: Go North East (https://northeastbuses.co.uk/forums/forumdisplay.php?fid=54) +--- Thread: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 (/showthread.php?tid=1831) Pages:
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RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - F114TML - 13 Oct 2022 (12 Oct 2022, 11:33 pm)Drifter60 It’s not about that. In this case a person living in Penshaw does not want to go into Sunderland City Centre via Chester Road, just to go back out of the city centre on a bus up Durham Road. It’s far far too convoluted and takes too long. And again it’s all about passenger perception, a friend tells me a family member living in South Hetton won’t use the new 61 to Dalton Park or Sunderland as it ‘goes round Murton twice’ instead she goes into Easington to connect with the Arriva, or waits to get a lift of course. The former will probably save no time at all, but it’s soul destroying sitting on a bus you feel is going around the world to get where you want. That 61 route in the devil, I’ve said it before but I’ll say it again.Only a masochist, or someone desparate, would take the 594 from Roker to Doxford (that route could easily be 23 to city centre, then X1), but someone from Town End Farm, Pallion or Pennywell on the other hand... I've seen it a couple of times and it was full - yes it's a minibus but still. I do think a Murton/Seaham - Sunderland route that goes via Doxy and the hospital could work, given hospital visiting times in the evening; changing at Park Lane at 8-9pm isn't the most attractive idea. RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - Andreos1 - 13 Oct 2022 (12 Oct 2022, 11:31 pm)ALavery Passenger numbers are falling because of the constant faff on they’re having due to cancellations and loss of services. It’s distrust or simply because they have the money not because ‘oh my god i have to change buses here how awful is that’ I agree, those factors will have an impact on passenger numbers. Except passenger numbers have been falling in general for years. We see routes that have existed for years and very little in the way of changes that adapt to changing work habits, new employment sites etc. It doesn't take a genius to work out there's some correlation or pattern in that. As for the X1 link. I didn't realise that was exclusive to Seaham to Newcastle, here's me thinking that different passengers in different areas were the focus. Its not. It's just you that are allowed a direct bus and direct bus you won't use every day. Whereas those who would love a direct bus every day, aren't allowed one. Got it. (12 Oct 2022, 11:33 pm)Drifter60 It’s not about that. In this case a person living in Penshaw does not want to go into Sunderland City Centre via Chester Road, just to go back out of the city centre on a bus up Durham Road. It’s far far too convoluted and takes too long. And again it’s all about passenger perception, a friend tells me a family member living in South Hetton won’t use the new 61 to Dalton Park or Sunderland as it ‘goes round Murton twice’ instead she goes into Easington to connect with the Arriva, or waits to get a lift of course. The former will probably save no time at all, but it’s soul destroying sitting on a bus you feel is going around the world to get where you want. That 61 route in the devil, I’ve said it before but I’ll say it again. And this is what it's all about. They're given the choice of a 20min walk and a direct bus or a trip heading in the wrong direction. Penshaw and Doxford Park was just one example. There are many more across the region and it baffles me, that operators ignore these potential gold mines in favour of sticking with the same old (that clearly doesn't work), no matter what colour the bus is painted that particular week. (13 Oct 2022, 6:11 am)Storx Couldn't someone from Penshaw walk to Shiney Row and get the 39B it's not that far :s Depending where in Penshaw they are, it's a canny hike. The area I picked (residential area in New Penshaw) is a 20min walk up and down hills from Shiney Row. Assuming they have the time, inclination or ability to do that everyday, it's not the nicest walk. Or it's a 5min walk down the hill and a 4 to Shiney Row (timing it to connect with a 39b). Same in reverse, but up hill. In the same time the person has got half way to Shiney, they would have been able to drive there (not get wet or cold) and sit at their desk with a coffee, ready for the day ahead. RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - ALavery - 13 Oct 2022 So reading through the recent posts I’ve come to the conclusion that if a bus takes a longish route intended to pick up enough passengers and generate revenue it’s bad and unattractive and destined to fail. On the other hand if a bus takes a direct route to suit a handful of passengers it’s bad and unattractive and destined to fail because it’s not generating money. When you look at it that way there’s no wonder people are switching to cars because they can’t be bothered with the change or 30 minute journey. I guess if you’re not prepared to make the journey you’re not going to. RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - Rob44 - 13 Oct 2022 In my view it got to be one of the hardest things ever to get some one leave their warm, comfortable, quite, non smelly, non dirty, plenty of seats, no school kids etc etc etc car and go back to the bus. What companies need to concentrate on is making bus travel so "seamless" that people without a car dont feel i necessary to strive to get one as the bus service is ( delete as appropriate) non existent, overrun with scoundrels, standing room only as cut from xxxx to yyyy per hour etc etc. I live 2.9 miles from where i work as the crow flies. If i use the bus now, after all the changes it takes me 45 minutes to get there with 1 change at team vally, 1 hour 45 minutes to get back with one change at gatehsead metro or 1.30mintues to get back with a change at lowfell but this now woudl cost more ££££ ad its a GNE and a GCT buses i'd use. In my new Hybrid car i can do the full route there and back on electric costing me about 20 bob! What would you use???? RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - Storx - 13 Oct 2022 (13 Oct 2022, 6:47 am)Dan Yes, that seemed to be a suggestion in Andreos’ example - and at that point the difference in journey time is just 9 minutes between bus and car (excluding the walk from Biddick Woods to the stop in Shiney Row, of course - 12 mins in car versus 19 mins on 39B). Yeah that's fair it's a shame they can't find a way to somehow merge the 39B (or something alternative) and 82 together (curtailed at Birtley). Would provide cross Washington links and it's not exactly far from Columbia to Shiney Row to connect them together. Would be a much better use of resources and connect more places to Doxford Park (even known I'm not sure there's that much demand mind). RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - ASX_Terranova - 13 Oct 2022 New Services 87/87A (PVR 3) 87: Heworth, Lingey Lane, Barmston Court, Washington Village, Glebe, Sainsbury's Car Park, The Galleries, Lambton (Cambrian Way), Wear Ind Est, Ayton, Crowther Ind Est, Oxclose, The Galleries, Sainsbury's Car Park, Glebe, Washington Village, Barmston Court, Lingey Lane, Heworth (Hourly). 87A: Heworth, Lingey Lane, Barmston Court, Washington Village, Glebe, Sainsbury's Car Park, The Galleries, Oxclose, Crowther Ind Est, Ayton, Wear Ind Est, Lambton (Cambrian Way), The Galleries, Sainsbury's Car Park, Glebe, Washington Village, Barmston Court, Lingey Lane, Heworth (Hourly). New Service 88 (PVR 3) 88: Heworth, Lingey Lane, High Usworth (top of Stone Cellar Road) Donwell (Bus Link), Albany (Moorway), The Galleries, Biddick, Fallowfield Way, Fatfield Bridge, Barnwell (The Limes) (Every 30 Mins) The 87/87A takes 80-85 minutes to do a round trip so would have interwork at heworth. The 88 also takes about 80-85 minutes to do a round trip. RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - Thomas12 - 13 Oct 2022 A very simple suggestion from me is splitting the Q3 into two routes, Great Park to Newcastle and Newcastle to Wallsend. It is a complete shambles at the minute (esp for a secured service in part) in terms of reliability - it doesn’t even appear to be mainly down to driver shortages either. RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - omnicity4659 - 13 Oct 2022 (13 Oct 2022, 5:44 pm)Thomas12 A very simple suggestion from me is splitting the Q3 into two routes, Great Park to Newcastle and Newcastle to Wallsend. I used the Q3 yesterday and quite a few people used it for cross-city links. RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - Thomas12 - 13 Oct 2022 (13 Oct 2022, 9:10 pm)omnicity4659 I used the Q3 yesterday and quite a few people used it for cross-city links. Maybe so, but the delays on the service are atrocious. RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - V514DFT - 14 Oct 2022 19- from Percy Main operates as follows Royal Quays, George Stephenson Way, North Shields Ferry Terminal, Fish Quay, then once per hour extends to Whitley Bay via old 11 route 40- current 41 to Howdon Tynemouth Road then Howdon Lane, Bewicke Street, Rosehill Road (Hail and Ride), Tynemouth Road, Churchill Street, Simonside Avenue, Savory Road, Holy Cross-St Peters Road, High Street East 41- reverse of the 40 311- from Hadrian Park continues to Wallsend via Coniston Road, Ridley Avenue, Tynemouth Road, High Street East, Wallsend Interchange Q3- split into Q1 and Q2 RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - Unber43 - 14 Oct 2022 (13 Oct 2022, 9:10 pm)omnicity4659 I used the Q3 yesterday and quite a few people used it for cross-city links.Like Great Park to Quayside or Great Park to Wallsend/St Peters Basin? As a user said they are always delayed. RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - Storx - 14 Oct 2022 (14 Oct 2022, 6:07 pm)V514DFT 19- from Percy Main operates as follows Royal Quays, George Stephenson Way, North Shields Ferry Terminal, Fish Quay, then once per hour extends to Whitley Bay via old 11 route If we're meddling around with these services and let's just say Arriva win the 19 and 317 contracts hypothetically as this will work better I'd do: 17: Cramlington -> Dudley Lane -> Fern Drive, 57A to Whitley Bay, 317 to North Shields Ferry - Every Hour 18: 57A from Cramlington to Whitley Bay, extended via 317 route to North Shields Ferry - Every Hour 19: 57 from Ashington to Cramlington, current route to Percy Main, old route to North Shields via Ferry first. - Every Hour 40 (Loop): 317 from North Shields to Wallsend, 41 from Wallsend to Hadrian Park, 335 from Hadrian Park to North Shields - Every 30 Minutes 41 (Loop): Reverse of above - Every 30 Minutes 40A/41A: Shorts from Wallsend to Hadrian Park via Wiltshire Drive - Every 30 Minutes 341: 335 from Killingworth to Hadrian Park, extended to Howdon via 41/41A loop 342: No Changes 335/57/57A/317 Withdrawn Would offer a much better services and more links rather than the current horseshoe routes we currently have all over the place with better connectivity to the Fish Quay / Ferry from all over and make some of the connections actually useful, Howdon to Killingworth; Whitley Bay to the ferry; better Silverlink connectivity etc. RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - V514DFT - 15 Oct 2022 (14 Oct 2022, 7:20 pm)Storx If we're meddling around with these services and let's just say Arriva win the 19 and 317 contracts hypothetically as this will work better I'd do:Some decent ideas there Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - cbma06 - 15 Oct 2022 (14 Oct 2022, 7:20 pm)Storx If we're meddling around with these services and let's just say Arriva win the 19 and 317 contracts hypothetically as this will work better I'd do: If Arriva so called wins the contracts, there’s nothing there can do with those services, as the timetables and routes are secured by the local authorities, bus companies can’t changed secured bus services, there are secured for a reason as it’s not profitable to be ran by a business who only wants profits, if Arriva wants to take on those secured service routes then there will have to register those routes commercially and then the local authorities can withdraw the contracts, but if the so called new bus service don’t provide the needs when Arriva changes the services then the secured contracts will have to be registered again. If you just suggesting a change between 2 or 3 contracts then it’s better to contacts the authorities who secured the contract to see if it’s possible Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - Unber43 - 15 Oct 2022 (15 Oct 2022, 3:03 pm)cbma06 If Arriva so called wins the contracts, there’s nothing there can do with those services, as the timetables and routes are secured by the local authorities, bus companies can’t changed secured bus services, there are secured for a reason as it’s not profitable to be ran by a business who only wants profits, if Arriva wants to take on those secured service routes then there will have to register those routes commercially and then the local authorities can withdraw the contracts, but if the so called new bus service don’t provide the needs when Arriva changes the services then the secured contracts will have to be registered again.Could you extend a service and take that part on commerically or not? Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - cbma06 - 15 Oct 2022 (15 Oct 2022, 3:09 pm)Unber43 Could you extend a service and take that part on commerically or not? I think the relevant bus operator would have to contact the local authority who secured the service, probably would do though Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - F114TML - 15 Oct 2022 (15 Oct 2022, 3:03 pm)cbma06 If Arriva so called wins the contracts, there’s nothing there can do with those services, as the timetables and routes are secured by the local authorities, bus companies can’t changed secured bus services, there are secured for a reason as it’s not profitable to be ran by a business who only wants profits, if Arriva wants to take on those secured service routes then there will have to register those routes commercially and then the local authorities can withdraw the contracts, but if the so called new bus service don’t provide the needs when Arriva changes the services then the secured contracts will have to be registered again.If this were true, the 39B would only run between Washington and Tunstall Bank, and would be numbered the 37. I believe LAs devide the route and timetable and in their bid, operators can specify a modified timetable, including extensions (in the above example; extending the 37 to Sunderland City Centre and Pennywell) which I assume they'd commercially take the hit on. I don't think they can change the secured section of the route though. Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - cbma06 - 15 Oct 2022 (15 Oct 2022, 3:22 pm)F114TML If this were true, the 39B would only run between Washington and Tunstall Bank, and would be numbered the 37. GNE did the same when there took the 37 before and it was extended to Sunderland And extended the 38 to Herrington burn then to Houghton, so it was like a half hourly service 37/38 from Sunderland to Herrington Burn via Tunstall Bank then hourly 37 Herrington Burn to Washington , while the 38 turned left at Herrington Burn to Houghton, didn’t last long and then the 37 became it’s own secured service again Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - ASX_Terranova - 15 Oct 2022 Could the 4 be diverted to Fewster Square, if not should there another Washington - Heworth service (i.e. 87/87A from post #2,586) RE: Go North East: Service Suggestions v2 - Storx - 15 Oct 2022 (15 Oct 2022, 3:03 pm)cbma06 If Arriva so called wins the contracts, there’s nothing there can do with those services, as the timetables and routes are secured by the local authorities, bus companies can’t changed secured bus services, there are secured for a reason as it’s not profitable to be ran by a business who only wants profits, if Arriva wants to take on those secured service routes then there will have to register those routes commercially and then the local authorities can withdraw the contracts, but if the so called new bus service don’t provide the needs when Arriva changes the services then the secured contracts will have to be registered again. It was all just hypothetical, I don't really expect them to happen but with the bus partnerships it would be nice and attempt to do something with the subsidised services to actually make them commercial by working together with local bus companies to see what can happen. The 62 and 39B extensions are much better use of services than short services duplicating routes and offering nothing worthwhile. The Nexus services are just a mangled mess right now and it doesn't help Nexus are funding the evening services for the others mentioned there (41/41A/57A). Arguably it's better for everyone, less subsidies if they are successful and better routes for the passengers. There's still the 341 and 342 there for Gateshead Taxis to get their hands on as they'll never be profitable and I'm sure GNE and Arriva wouldn't be against it if it guarantees that Arriva get the 19 which heavily competes against their 57/57A and GNE get the 41/41A in the evening rather the likes of Gateshead Taxis running them and the Wallsend half of the 317 which competes heavily against the 1 |