Rising H2S costs call for more competition: Durham CC
Rising H2S costs call for more competition: Durham CC
think Northumberland CC did an overhaul of H2S at the start of this term.
I've just been reading through the DCC cabinet paper for this, and was quite shocked that they have over 1,000 individual contracts for H2S transport. So a review, preferably by someone with experience of designing services, would probably be beneficial. I wonder how many schools in a similar area, for example, all have individual buses? Most operating no where near capacity, when instead you could have one bus serving say three schools.
I think one thing they'll be looking at very closely again, is the statutory walking limits from the Education Act 1995. This will either be to remove some H2S transport or to factor in a more significant walk to/from a bus stop, to allow the number of services to be reduced. They say as much in one of the consultation points that they've outlined, looking at H2S being more a connection to other public transport, rather than the current door to door service.
A lot of those contracts are taxis that already do a convoluted route, often with kids who need to travel a fair distance for a suitable education and are already pushed to their limits in terms of being in a full taxi for longer than they're comfortable with.
The special school around the corner from us had no available places in its specialist provision at both the time of Youngest starting secondary school and 6th form, so he travels at least 25 minutes each way (not that we're sore about it as the provision there is simply better for him all round, both in terms of personnel and physical environment). He is severely autistic rather than quirky autistic and sharing a taxi went disastrously wrong for him and his reaction was distressing for the other passengers so he travels solo.
I'm sure a lot of other individual contracts involve high needs or children in unique circumstances such as needing to travel between establishments, a shortened school day, needing to carry a huge amount of medical equipment and so on.
(10 Feb 2023, 1:21 pm)BusLoverMum A lot of those contracts are taxis that already do a convoluted route, often with kids who need to travel a fair distance for a suitable education and are already pushed to their limits in terms of being in a full taxi for longer than they're comfortable with.
The special school around the corner from us had no available places in its specialist provision at both the time of Youngest starting secondary school and 6th form, so he travels at least 25 minutes each way (not that we're sore about it as the provision there is simply better for him all round, both in terms of personnel and physical environment). He is severely autistic rather than quirky autistic and sharing a taxi went disastrously wrong for him and his reaction was distressing for the other passengers so he travels solo.
I'm sure a lot of other individual contracts involve high needs or children in unique circumstances such as needing to travel between establishments, a shortened school day, needing to carry a huge amount of medical equipment and so on.
(10 Feb 2023, 1:21 pm)BusLoverMum A lot of those contracts are taxis that already do a convoluted route, often with kids who need to travel a fair distance for a suitable education and are already pushed to their limits in terms of being in a full taxi for longer than they're comfortable with.
The special school around the corner from us had no available places in its specialist provision at both the time of Youngest starting secondary school and 6th form, so he travels at least 25 minutes each way (not that we're sore about it as the provision there is simply better for him all round, both in terms of personnel and physical environment). He is severely autistic rather than quirky autistic and sharing a taxi went disastrously wrong for him and his reaction was distressing for the other passengers so he travels solo.
I'm sure a lot of other individual contracts involve high needs or children in unique circumstances such as needing to travel between establishments, a shortened school day, needing to carry a huge amount of medical equipment and so on.
(10 Feb 2023, 1:38 pm)Adrian It's actually a bit worrying how the Council report is laid out when referring to special educational needs. They're committing to reviewing individual needs, but for me it reads that they're being reviewed to see that H2S transport is actually required. Page 17: https://democracy.durham.gov.uk/document...tation.pdfAh, that interesting word for make it go away, "socialisation"
(10 Feb 2023, 1:38 pm)Adrian It's actually a bit worrying how the Council report is laid out when referring to special educational needs. They're committing to reviewing individual needs, but for me it reads that they're being reviewed to see that H2S transport is actually required. Page 17: https://democracy.durham.gov.uk/document...tation.pdfAh, that interesting word for make it go away, "socialisation"
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Like most councils it would probably help if they had people in transport who had time to sit down and look at their network and how to save cash. Unfortunately they end up just tendering the same network time after time whether it makes sense or not.
There will be loads of cases where routes could be merged to save cost or they’ve added extra buses in here and there rather than just extend routes to cover extra areas. Likely there’s a load of routes using larger vehicles than required (more cost!)
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When I had my Nexus school bus pass, it allowed me to use any bus between home and school, so I could either use the dedicated scholars, or the GNE bus that went the same way, but that doesn't seem to be the case in Durham? And maybe not even in Nexusland now?
Maybe it's just my brother's school, but he is only allowed to use the one bus that goes into the estate, he can't get any of the other 4 buses that go nearby, or the Arriva bus.
They also have a late scholars bus for the after school clubs, but you're only allowed on it if you're pre-booked onto it. So if he misses the first bus he's screwed. He either has to pay for the Arriva bus back, or call for a lift.
In fact, after school I would often just go to the Metrocentre on my school bus pass and never once had an issue, sometimes I'd even be able to make it home!
(12 Feb 2023, 3:06 pm)streetdeckfan When I had my Nexus school bus pass, it allowed me to use any bus between home and school, so I could either use the dedicated scholars, or the GNE bus that went the same way, but that doesn't seem to be the case in Durham? And maybe not even in Nexusland now?
Maybe it's just my brother's school, but he is only allowed to use the one bus that goes into the estate, he can't get any of the other 4 buses that go nearby, or the Arriva bus.
They also have a late scholars bus for the after school clubs, but you're only allowed on it if you're pre-booked onto it. So if he misses the first bus he's screwed. He either has to pay for the Arriva bus back, or call for a lift.
In fact, after school I would often just go to the Metrocentre on my school bus pass and never once had an issue, sometimes I'd even be able to make it home!
(12 Feb 2023, 3:06 pm)streetdeckfan When I had my Nexus school bus pass, it allowed me to use any bus between home and school, so I could either use the dedicated scholars, or the GNE bus that went the same way, but that doesn't seem to be the case in Durham? And maybe not even in Nexusland now?
Maybe it's just my brother's school, but he is only allowed to use the one bus that goes into the estate, he can't get any of the other 4 buses that go nearby, or the Arriva bus.
They also have a late scholars bus for the after school clubs, but you're only allowed on it if you're pre-booked onto it. So if he misses the first bus he's screwed. He either has to pay for the Arriva bus back, or call for a lift.
In fact, after school I would often just go to the Metrocentre on my school bus pass and never once had an issue, sometimes I'd even be able to make it home!
(12 Feb 2023, 6:02 pm)MurdnunoC It was more or less the same when I attended school in the early-mid 90s. Although it didn't apply to me as I lived within walking distance of the school, pupils were issued with a red bus pass which permitted travel between two points (School and, for example, Whickham, Rowlands Gill, Ryton, Dunston, Chopwell etc.) within specific time-windows before and after school.
Like you, I knew of pupils who opted not to use the school bus for whatever reason, and travelled to Metrocentre before transferring onto another service. As far as I'm aware, nobody was ever refused travel for doing this.
(12 Feb 2023, 6:02 pm)MurdnunoC It was more or less the same when I attended school in the early-mid 90s. Although it didn't apply to me as I lived within walking distance of the school, pupils were issued with a red bus pass which permitted travel between two points (School and, for example, Whickham, Rowlands Gill, Ryton, Dunston, Chopwell etc.) within specific time-windows before and after school.
Like you, I knew of pupils who opted not to use the school bus for whatever reason, and travelled to Metrocentre before transferring onto another service. As far as I'm aware, nobody was ever refused travel for doing this.
(12 Feb 2023, 6:02 pm)MurdnunoC It was more or less the same when I attended school in the early-mid 90s. Although it didn't apply to me as I lived within walking distance of the school, pupils were issued with a red bus pass which permitted travel between two points (School and, for example, Whickham, Rowlands Gill, Ryton, Dunston, Chopwell etc.) within specific time-windows before and after school.
Like you, I knew of pupils who opted not to use the school bus for whatever reason, and travelled to Metrocentre before transferring onto another service. As far as I'm aware, nobody was ever refused travel for doing this.
(12 Feb 2023, 6:02 pm)MurdnunoC It was more or less the same when I attended school in the early-mid 90s. Although it didn't apply to me as I lived within walking distance of the school, pupils were issued with a red bus pass which permitted travel between two points (School and, for example, Whickham, Rowlands Gill, Ryton, Dunston, Chopwell etc.) within specific time-windows before and after school.
Like you, I knew of pupils who opted not to use the school bus for whatever reason, and travelled to Metrocentre before transferring onto another service. As far as I'm aware, nobody was ever refused travel for doing this.
(12 Feb 2023, 8:58 pm)Andreos1 Same school era, but we were issued with the TWPTE Cat pass that meant we paid the child fare of 15p (went up to 20p) and we could use any bus we wanted.
There were scholars (some commercially operated), but it was just as easy using a normal public service.
Had no idea those passes you mention were even a thing within T&W back then.
(12 Feb 2023, 8:58 pm)Andreos1 Same school era, but we were issued with the TWPTE Cat pass that meant we paid the child fare of 15p (went up to 20p) and we could use any bus we wanted.
There were scholars (some commercially operated), but it was just as easy using a normal public service.
Had no idea those passes you mention were even a thing within T&W back then.
I must be getting old lol
I went to school in the 80s, South Tyneside and my bus fares were 5p in the Juniors (yes in those days aged 8 to 11, I travelled on my own to and from school on public bus) and in comp the fare was 10p. I remember a friend at school lived just over the 3 mile boundary and was entitled to free travel to and from school on public buses, something like 0800 -0900 and 1530- 1630. So free travel was in those days also, but a 3 mile ruling was also in place (you had to live over the 3 miles(
(12 Feb 2023, 9:14 pm)MurdnunoC I had the green pass too, but the red one was issued if you lived three or more miles away from the school I believe. Obviously, living in Winlaton and going to St Thomas More, I didn't qualify otherwise I would have been using it to go to Metrocentre or into town in the evening.
(12 Feb 2023, 9:43 pm)ifm001 I must be getting old lol
I went to school in the 80s, South Tyneside and my bus fares were 5p in the Juniors (yes in those days aged 8 to 11, I travelled on my own to and from school on public bus) and in comp the fare was 10p. I remember a friend at school lived just over the 3 mile boundary and was entitled to free travel to and from school on public buses, something like 0800 -0900 and 1530- 1630. So free travel was in those days also, but a 3 mile ruling was also in place (you had to live over the 3 miles(
(12 Feb 2023, 9:14 pm)MurdnunoC I had the green pass too, but the red one was issued if you lived three or more miles away from the school I believe. Obviously, living in Winlaton and going to St Thomas More, I didn't qualify otherwise I would have been using it to go to Metrocentre or into town in the evening.
(12 Feb 2023, 9:43 pm)ifm001 I must be getting old lol
I went to school in the 80s, South Tyneside and my bus fares were 5p in the Juniors (yes in those days aged 8 to 11, I travelled on my own to and from school on public bus) and in comp the fare was 10p. I remember a friend at school lived just over the 3 mile boundary and was entitled to free travel to and from school on public buses, something like 0800 -0900 and 1530- 1630. So free travel was in those days also, but a 3 mile ruling was also in place (you had to live over the 3 miles(
(12 Feb 2023, 8:58 pm)Andreos1 Same school era, but we were issued with the TWPTE Cat pass that meant we paid the child fare of 15p (went up to 20p) and we could use any bus we wanted.
There were scholars (some commercially operated), but it was just as easy using a normal public service.
Had no idea those passes you mention were even a thing within T&W back then.
(12 Feb 2023, 8:58 pm)Andreos1 Same school era, but we were issued with the TWPTE Cat pass that meant we paid the child fare of 15p (went up to 20p) and we could use any bus we wanted.
There were scholars (some commercially operated), but it was just as easy using a normal public service.
Had no idea those passes you mention were even a thing within T&W back then.
(12 Feb 2023, 6:02 pm)MurdnunoC It was more or less the same when I attended school in the early-mid 90s. Although it didn't apply to me as I lived within walking distance of the school, pupils were issued with a red bus pass which permitted travel between two points (School and, for example, Whickham, Rowlands Gill, Ryton, Dunston, Chopwell etc.) within specific time-windows before and after school.
Like you, I knew of pupils who opted not to use the school bus for whatever reason, and travelled to Metrocentre before transferring onto another service. As far as I'm aware, nobody was ever refused travel for doing this.
(12 Feb 2023, 6:02 pm)MurdnunoC It was more or less the same when I attended school in the early-mid 90s. Although it didn't apply to me as I lived within walking distance of the school, pupils were issued with a red bus pass which permitted travel between two points (School and, for example, Whickham, Rowlands Gill, Ryton, Dunston, Chopwell etc.) within specific time-windows before and after school.
Like you, I knew of pupils who opted not to use the school bus for whatever reason, and travelled to Metrocentre before transferring onto another service. As far as I'm aware, nobody was ever refused travel for doing this.
