(05 Feb 2021, 6:38 pm)Storx Not sure which post it was so I haven't quoted but you keep mentioning simplifying tickets and how GNE will be in a better position than Arriva etc but surely now is the time you really need to work together in certain areas and if you did overall it would be better for everyone.

(05 Feb 2021, 5:30 pm)Dan The dual-door buses were re-trimmed into Go-Ahead London's moquette shortly before being acquired, which was one of the main reasons nothing was ever done with them. They were, and still are, in very good condition. The second reason being that they were only ever acquired for the Tall Ships event, and remained in the fleet due to the fact Go North East were awarded a sizeable number of scholars contracts in July to commence operation in September (despite there being a large volume of work, such as the Sunderland Airshow, for these vehicles to be allocated to, between award of the contracts and their commencement).

The Scania OmniDekkas on the other hand were incredibly poor quality, but, as normal, were rushed out into service as quickly as possible, due to the business requirements at the time. There was a long-term project to re-trim the seats in all the Scania OmniDekkas on a rolling basis. All bar 6122 were completed (this one intentionally not being done due to it being the oldest in the batch, and planned for withdrawal this year).

Cannot deny that the quality of the refurbishment on Arriva's pre-owned vehicles is sublime - alas the downside to this is that the cost of the refurbishment (including centre-door conversion) would have been more than the cost of the bus, and as such they're probably lumbered with those buses for many years to come now (whereas Go North East's examples are close to being fully depreciated so could, in theory, be easily disposed of, should newer stock become available).

The first 57-plate ex-B&H OmniDekka is due back from repaint next week - I wonder how the interior will be presented?

As much as I'd love to agree with you on scholars being the 'customers of the future', unfortunately I'd have to disagree in this instance as very few show any kind of regard for the buses that they're using. Most vandalise them.


That, or operators factor into the cost of their bid the cost of undertaking significant refurbishment work, coming at the expense of the taxpayer (I'm sure that wouldn't be popular, either!)

(05 Feb 2021, 6:38 pm)Storx Not sure which post it was so I haven't quoted but you keep mentioning simplifying tickets and how GNE will be in a better position than Arriva etc but surely now is the time you really need to work together in certain areas and if you did overall it would be better for everyone.

For example in North Tyneside you've got the North Tyneside smartzone and then the Newcastle smartzone tickets. I'm not sure who sets them up but surely an offering of a ticket which covers both North Tyneside and Newcastle which is priced around the £19 - £21 mark a week would a good offer for quite a chunk of passengers with the potential of use to the Metro Centre as a bonus and try and get the Nexus buses on board aswell. You's are all going to struggle at the end of the day the biggest competitor in the area is the Metro and always will be. Least then you've got a bus vs metro war as right now if your the wrong area buses just aren't an option and it gives endless more oppertunities for some punters for example those in Holy Cross who could get the 41 to Wallsend then jump on the 22 to Newcastle for example or someone in Briardene can jump on the W3 and then get the first bus that turns up to Newcastle.

Right now it's very unattractive for a typical passenger as the only intermodal ticket are Network One tickets (which are impossible to buy) which costs £29.60 and you'd jump on the metro anyway and that isn't cheap nor value for money. It then get's even worse for a passenger wanting to travel from Cramlington to Tynemouth for example which involves 2 operators and there's no intermodal ticket at all. Surely these are the places where things could be improved. I'm not sure how much say you have in Smartzones, but they'd be popular if they were expanded for the whole of the North of Tyne like that exists down Tees Valley which covers pretty much everywhere for those that need it as long as it's priced above the individual Arriva and your offers, no-one is really losing out. I know Teesside isn't mentioned much on here but the Tees Valley tickets are excellent value for money imo considering you travel all the way from Darlington to Saltburn and Hartlepool.

(05 Feb 2021, 6:46 pm)streetdeckfan To be fair, I was put off using the bus for years after the experience I had on scholars buses, not sure what they were but they were piles of shite (they were 'yellow bus' branded 10 ish years ago).

(05 Feb 2021, 6:55 pm)6049 For your own safety, if you're referring to an Olympian, do not say that in front of a driver who drove them. I never had the pleasure but I've never met anyone who didn't love driving them!

Sent from my SM-G981B using Tapatalk

(05 Feb 2021, 7:04 pm)Rapidsnap To be honest the school bus fleet at GNE tended to be kept in decent condition in my opinion with any damage quickly repaired. I recall seeing various operators repairing seats using heavy duty tape.

Anyone game for count the different seat covers - https://www.flickr.com/photos/gjm-photogenic/32652483586

(05 Feb 2021, 7:16 pm)Dan You'll set streetdeckfan off, sharing images like that. I'm amazed he's resisted comment thus far on how the coaches for the X9/X10 means that there is *yet another* style of seat used on an X-lines service.

(05 Feb 2021, 6:43 pm)Dan This is exactly what operators are currently lobbying for, under the NEbus guise.

• Durham zone to be introduced in 2019
  
• Working group currently considering fare capping trial
  

(05 Feb 2021, 7:20 pm)Storx Interestly never heard of that before, just a had look through - https://nebuscouk.files.wordpress.com/2019/08/nebus-launch-presentation-280819.pdf and there's a few interesting things in there especially the following 2 things:

• Durham zone to be introduced in 2019
  
• Working group currently considering fare capping trial
  

Guessing both of them have been cancelled for the time being as neither came around.

The publicity map and route maps in Newcastle City Centre looked really helpful aswell but I've never seen them publicised anywhere, it's the sort of thing that's need more imo. Shame really.

(05 Feb 2021, 7:36 pm)Richyyyk Undeniably there have been many improvements with GNE but some sneaky downgrades too; the 58 currently running with 03 reg Omnis since their Versas were deemed needed for the Q3 more.
Fair play an upgrade in capacity but a massive downgrade in terms of passenger comfort

(05 Feb 2021, 7:37 pm)Dan Yes, that was the presentation used at the launch of the NEbus initiative, back in August 2019, at the Life Science Centre in Newcastle. Stakeholders were invited to watch the presentation, with the three Managing Directors of Arriva, Go North East and Stagecoach all spoke, along with Andrew Scott from Stanley Travel representing SME operators.

The Durham SmartZone ticket was postponed, but is still planned to be introduced, now early this year, and the 'fare capping' trial has been introduced by Go North East (on the VOLTRA electric buses) but not adopted more widely yet. Go North East plans a further extension on another route very soon.

A lot of work went into the leaflet and route maps for Newcastle City Centre - Go North East led on their production (as Martijn is the Chair of the NEbus panel). Very time-consuming and arguably something that ought to be led by Nexus, given they control what is shown and where.

(05 Feb 2021, 7:37 pm)Dan .

Starting next week; the OmniDekkas will be replaced gradually by Volvo B9s, which become available on return of the Volvo B9s from refurbishment.

Go North East plans a further extension on another route very soon.

(05 Feb 2021, 5:20 pm)Dan Nice analogy, and perhaps the best points you've made in this debate yet... but the point you're missing is that the beans (bus) are actually better than they used to be.

Through all the upgrades undertaken over the last 12 months the product has improved (albeit mainly just better comfort and quality):

• services X70/X71 upgraded from ex-London Volvo B9 with lacklustre quality seating to brand new, Euro 6 double-deck buses, with more comfortable seats, tables, next stop announcements, wireless/USB charging points (and previous free Wi-Fi offering still maintained)
  
• due to the above, services 93/94 upgraded from aged Scania L94s to double-deck Volvo B9, with free Wi-Fi and next stop announcements (a first for these routes).
  
• services X45/X46/X47 upgraded from Wright Streetlites to brand new, Euro 6 buses, crucially double-deck instead of the previous single-deck to offer passengers a more comfortable journey during busier periods, with all the same (and better) mod-cons than the previous buses.
  
• service X20 upgraded from Optare Solo SRs to Wright Streetlites, offering more space than the previous buses allocated.
  
• service 35 upgraded from Scania L94s to Mercedes Citaros, bringing Wi-Fi, USB charging points and next stop announcements to this route for the first time.
  
• service X1 upgraded from Volvo B9 to brand new Euro 6 double-decks, with all the same (and better) features than the previous buses, including tables and charging points.
  
• due to the above, services 26/27 upgraded from single-deck to refurbished double-deck Volvo B9, offering better capacity to passengers on this route during busier periods, and quality internally.
  
• services X9/X10 upgraded from buses to more purpose-built coaches
  
• buses on service 4 given a light refurbishment due to 'below-par' quality standards
  
• buses on service 56 given a light refurbishment due to 'below-par' quality standards
  

All of this cannot just be dismissed, as it is being currently. These are very clear benefits and improvements to passengers, which, when paired with better/cheaper ticketing options (unlike other operators, Go North East hasn't increased the price of its tickets - Stagecoach and Arriva still undertook the same traditional fares increase, when Go North East decided to reduce fares and introduce new tickets) and better cleaning regimes (which we should all hope remain in place, post-COVID), do provide a better quality product than what was offered previously.

I really am not dismissing your point about network improvements, and I do agree that more can and should be done, but I go back to what I have alluded several times now... Is it best that operators take the 'do nothing' approach and make no network improvements (because they can't afford to) or do they try and improve the product through a cheaper method in order to drive growth and build the route back in order to allow them to make network improvements?

(05 Feb 2021, 8:59 pm)Michael Wonder what route that could be,  21 extension happening?, not sure where the extra Streetdecks will come from though.

So I take it that means Deptford will start to lose the GNE livery B9's to Riverside.

(05 Feb 2021, 7:37 pm)Dan Yes, that was the presentation used at the launch of the NEbus initiative, back in August 2019, at the Life Science Centre in Newcastle. Stakeholders were invited to watch the presentation, with the three Managing Directors of Arriva, Go North East and Stagecoach all spoke, along with Andrew Scott from Stanley Travel representing SME operators.

The Durham SmartZone ticket was postponed, but is still planned to be introduced, now early this year, and the 'fare capping' trial has been introduced by Go North East (on the VOLTRA electric buses) but not adopted more widely yet. Go North East plans a further extension on another route very soon.

A lot of work went into the leaflet and route maps for Newcastle City Centre - Go North East led on their production (as Martijn is the Chair of the NEbus panel). Very time-consuming and arguably something that ought to be led by Nexus, given they control what is shown and where.

(05 Feb 2021, 8:59 pm)Michael Wonder what route that could be,  21 extension happening?, not sure where the extra Streetdecks will come from though.

So I take it that means Deptford will start to lose the GNE livery B9's to Riverside.

(05 Feb 2021, 10:06 pm)Storx Might want to reread that, it's not an extension to a route

(05 Feb 2021, 10:20 pm)Michael Go North East plans a further extension on another route very soon.

That to me indicated a route will be extended.

(05 Feb 2021, 10:22 pm)Storx Nah it's another route for the tap in tap out that's on the Voltra as I mentioned that it must've been abandoned as it was supposed to be done in 2019 (forgot about it on there ngl).