Might stop a bit of the confusion with us GNE drivers when kids get on with £1 thinking it's the same as Stagecoach. Or maybe it won't, because kids.

It was £1 for kids on GNE until September so it's an easy mistake to make.

---

Depends on the journey I've found for that. Arriva have fare zones which are roughly every three or four bus stops whereas GNE have zones which cover miles so if you live at the start of the zone it's expensive but live at the end of it then it's cheaper.

I believe the 21 zones from Newcastle are Newcastle through to Harlow Green (£1.70) then there all the way through to Barley Moor (£3.10) then to Plawsworth (£3.60) then Durham (£4.60). So if you got on at Harlow Green it'll be quite cheap get on the next bus stop the Coach and Horses it's £3.10 and a rip off whereas Arriva will have a fare to The Cannon, Harlow Green, Coach and Horses, Birtley (£2.60'ish I believe), Barley Moor etc.

Arriva have an invisible boundary tax where if you cross the Tyne and Wear / Northumberland boundary there's a massive fare jump for no reason at all however. I know at one point it was cheaper to buy a single from Seghill to Annitsford then a single from there to Newcastle than it was to buy a single from Seghill to Newcastle on the X7.

Arriva are definitely cheaper around Durham city. It used to be that it was cheaper to buy Arriva weekly/monthly tickets than GNE to get to Spenny, too, though the GNE zones change may have fixed that as an ANE durham district ticket has become more pricey as that area has expanded and GNE all zones isn't much more, now. It's still cheaper to get to Newcastle and back from durham on ANE but I've only ever done that once. I set out to do that another time and the X12 didn't even show up, so I just got the next Angel and a Castles daysaver. I'd rather pay a pound odd more for a guarantee that I don't have to wait an hour for a bus to show up.

No mention of the 3-4 day ticket since MG tweeted about it. Hopefully it will be introduced soon. I think it will be a good addition to GNE's range of tickets, but we don't know much about it yet.

It was £1 for kids on GNE until September so it's an easy mistake to make.

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Arriva are definitely cheaper around Durham city. It used to be that it was cheaper to buy Arriva weekly/monthly tickets than GNE to get to Spenny, too, though the GNE zones change may have fixed that as an ANE durham district ticket has become more pricey as that area has expanded and GNE all zones isn't much more, now. It's still cheaper to get to Newcastle and back from durham on ANE but I've only ever done that once. I set out to do that another time and the X12 didn't even show up, so I just got the next Angel and a Castles daysaver. I'd rather pay a pound odd more for a guarantee that I don't have to wait an hour for a bus to show up.

I used the X12 between Durham and Newcastle during CTBW, and I will never be doing it again!
I made an effort of trying to only use Arriva services that day and I was genuinely surprised how unreliable the Arriva services were, I know it's not unusual to have 2 6 services following each other from Bishop to Durham, but I just put that down to the 6 being far too frequent. 
To be fair though, the X12 back down was actually on time, whereas the 21 never showed! 

If we look at the pricing of the X21 and the Arriva 6, it's all a bit of a mess!
If you're travelling between Bishop Auckland and Durham, for a day ticket (Auckland Castle Saver and Service 6 Routesaver), it's the same price, but for the weekly ticket Arriva is £2.50 cheaper.
If you want to travel between West Auckland and Durham, for the day ticket (Xlines X21 Saver and Service 6 Routesaver Plus), GNE is 50p cheaper, but for the weekly ticket Arriva is 20p cheaper. However, the GNE ticket will allow you to travel between West Auckland and Newcastle, whereas the Arriva ticket is only West Auckland to Durham (Fram during peak times)
Now, if we look at single prices, from Tindale to Spennymoor on Arriva it's £4.80 (according to live chat anyway, I ended up buying a day ticket instead so don't know if it's accurate), with GNE it's only £3.10, but from Tindale to Bishop with Arriva it's £1.40 and GNE £1.60.

I used the X12 between Durham and Newcastle during CTBW, and I will never be doing it again!
I made an effort of trying to only use Arriva services that day and I was genuinely surprised how unreliable the Arriva services were, I know it's not unusual to have 2 6 services following each other from Bishop to Durham, but I just put that down to the 6 being far too frequent. 
To be fair though, the X12 back down was actually on time, whereas the 21 never showed! 

If we look at the pricing of the X21 and the Arriva 6, it's all a bit of a mess!
If you're travelling between Bishop Auckland and Durham, for a day ticket (Auckland Castle Saver and Service 6 Routesaver), it's the same price, but for the weekly ticket Arriva is £2.50 cheaper.
If you want to travel between West Auckland and Durham, for the day ticket (Xlines X21 Saver and Service 6 Routesaver Plus), GNE is 50p cheaper, but for the weekly ticket Arriva is 20p cheaper. However, the GNE ticket will allow you to travel between West Auckland and Newcastle, whereas the Arriva ticket is only West Auckland to Durham (Fram during peak times)
Now, if we look at single prices, from Tindale to Spennymoor on Arriva it's £4.80 (according to live chat anyway, I ended up buying a day ticket instead so don't know if it's accurate), with GNE it's only £3.10, but from Tindale to Bishop with Arriva it's £1.40 and GNE £1.60.

A service 6 routesaver is no good to me as I have to get the 64 before the 6, hence the Durham District ticket. I can get the X21 door to door but it's less frequent and I've spent enough time waiting at 4 lane ends for a lifetime, already.

The problem with the 6 is largely congestion on church street and south road, combined with students who catch it in their dozens to save a 10 minute walk. As soon as you add any complications like the current roadworks around Tudhoe then it can't keep time at all. It's a busy service at almost any time on a weekday so definitely not too frequent.

No mention of the 3-4 day ticket since MG tweeted about it. Hopefully it will be introduced soon. I think it will be a good addition to GNE's range of tickets, but we don't know much about it yet.

It was only about 4 days ago he tweeted it. Give them a chance!

It was only about 4 days ago he tweeted it. Give them a chance!

Fair enough. I am just excited because he didn't give much away! They recently introduced the 24 hour and evening tickets, all praise for GNE! Stagecoach only has singles and day tickets, then weekly, monthly, annual (?)...boring, very limited ticket range. Stagecoach could get away with higher fares on expresses than normal services if they wanted to, and then introduce route savers for services only going into the City Centre, not passing through like the 12, 22, 39/40, 62/63 etc, so all expresses and the 71, 72 and 87.
.

The bus users UK twitter feed is a cracking read today. 
Hopefully it has woken a few from their ignorant slumber and we see changes ahead. 

https://twitter.com/BusUsersUK/status/12...90177?s=19

https://twitter.com/BusUsersUK/status/12...21321?s=19

Just two examples.

The bus users UK twitter feed is a cracking read today. 
Hopefully it has woken a few from their ignorant slumber and we see changes ahead. 

https://twitter.com/BusUsersUK/status/12...90177?s=19

https://twitter.com/BusUsersUK/status/12...21321?s=19

Just two examples.

Hell, they came across an account that seemed to be run by Katie Hopkins in her bus driver days.

Hell, they came across an account that seemed to be run by Katie Hopkins in her bus driver days.

Is that necessarily a bad thing?

These days, especially on social media, the only way to get your point across is to be louder than everyone else.

It's no use hiding behind a corporate image, the most successful people/companies are the ones that say exactly what they think, have a bit of fun, have arguments, heck even cause 'offence' (though as we all know, offence can only be taken, not given). It's why the likes of Katie Hopkins and Piers Morgan are so popular.

Is that necessarily a bad thing?

These days, especially on social media, the only way to get your point across is to be louder than everyone else.

It's no use hiding behind a corporate image, the most successful people/companies are the ones that say exactly what they think, have a bit of fun, have arguments, heck even cause 'offence' (though as we all know, offence can only be taken, not given). It's why the likes of Katie Hopkins and Piers Morgan are so popular.

I think it is a bad thing when the responsibility is put on often vulnerable people not to be upset by other people's unpleasantness.

Hell, they came across an account that seemed to be run by Katie Hopkins in her bus driver days.

It was certainly something that stirred conversation and if it has the desired result for passengers - brilliant.

Stagecoach fares going up tomorrow. Ridiculous.

Stagecoach fares going up tomorrow. Ridiculous.

Nothing to do with having to fund Euro 6 mods, paying their staff in line with inflation and buying new buses then? Not to mention the fluctuating fuel prices which are bouncing up and down by 10p every so often...

Nothing to do with having to fund Euro 6 mods, paying their staff in line with inflation and buying new buses then? Not to mention the fluctuating fuel prices which are bouncing up and down by 10p every so often...

When I needed to travel in to Stagecoach territory I was looking at the tickets and thought they were too cheap so I'm not surprised they've put them up.
The issue is people these days just expect everything to be handed to them for free and don't seem to take in to account the actual costs of doing business!

I think I've mentioned it before, but people look at the price of a bus ticket in London and think it should be that price everywhere without realising that it's heavily subsidised, and even then once you've done a few journeys it actually works out cheaper up here with the day/week tickets.

Nothing to do with having to fund Euro 6 mods, paying their staff in line with inflation and buying new buses then? Not to mention the fluctuating fuel prices which are bouncing up and down by 10p every so often...

For me personally, Go North East is better value. As for Euro 6 modifications, I doubt the average passenger cares, or is even aware this is happening. Paying their staff in line with inflation, buying new buses and fuel prices I can understand, however they could put their fares up by more, and less often to cover these costs which they plan for in advance, in addition to offering an equal service. Some of my local buses are newer than others, but are certainly not the newest, and that is when they actually turn up! From personal experience, the buses are mixed between old and new, and the service provided is well...not always provided. Stagecoach has been a big problem in my life, for education, for work and for leisure (and for volunteering, but that is less of an issue, even though still an issue). I do not like Stagecoach or Gateshead Central Taxis, and don't use Arriva because I find them even worse! Go North East is the best for me.

Nothing to do with having to fund Euro 6 mods, paying their staff in line with inflation and buying new buses then? Not to mention the fluctuating fuel prices which are bouncing up and down by 10p every so often...

Surely a business like Stagecoach have bought their fuel well in advance? Most if not all of the big operators hedge their fuel. 

However going back to the other points you raise, they might all be true. Except that isn't what SNE are telling the media. 
They're telling the media that traffic is causing issues and to counter that traffic, they're having to use extra buses. 

 

"Operating costs within our business have risen, predominantly due to the growing effect of congestion in our towns and cities, which pushes up the cost of delivering our services and impacts our ability to keep fares low for our customers. For example, in   Newcastle over the last five year, Stagecoach North East has increased the number of vehicles required during peak times by an additional 10 buses as a direct result of traffic congestion.

"Using additional vehicles and drivers to try and maintain punctuality for customers adds almost £2m each year.

 

Source: https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/whats-on...e-17760592

We all know that raising prices isn't going to reduce the amount of traffic on the road. I would hazard a guess and say that it may have the opposite effect and increase traffic on the road.

To be fair to Stagecoach most their tickets are reasonably priced and even with the increases aren't bad value. The day ticket in Newcastle is the same price as a single for certain journeys with GNE and Arriva from just just outside of T&W (the same distance as Ponteland where it's only £4.70 for a day). It's £4.60 for a single from Ouston to Gateshead for example.

To be fair to Stagecoach most their tickets are reasonably priced and even with the increases aren't bad value. The day ticket in Newcastle is the same price as a single for certain journeys with GNE and Arriva from just just outside of T&W (the same distance as Ponteland where it's only £4.70 for a day). It's £4.60 for a single from Ouston to Gateshead for example.

I agree that compared to some, the prices are more attractive. 
Could it be that there's more competition on the local SNE services (longer distance ANE and GNE ops and Metro as an example) or are they pricing their offer in such a way that it meets the financial demands of the markets they're serving?

Either way, I can't see the logic in their statement at all. 
Using basic economics and following the demand curve principle, then passenger numbers will fall.
That's forgetting that any traffic they're blaming, could get worse.

I agree that compared to some, the prices are more attractive. 
Could it be that there's more competition on the local SNE services (longer distance ANE and GNE ops and Metro as an example) or are they pricing their offer in such a way that it meets the financial demands of the markets they're serving?

I always thought it was more the opposite way around especially with the West End. Charge it at a rate which is just enough and reasonable to the customer instead of charging too much and letting the competition sneak in as the majority of their bus routes have little / no competition at all but not too cheap that their losing money. On the other hand GNE, Arriva and the Metro are battling each other and also have run long distance services through pretty much no-where with some routes.

It wouldn't surprise me if Stagecoach had the top 5 busiest bus routes in the North East. (1, 22, 38, 39/40 and 62/63). There's only really the 21 which could come close to any of those.

Either way, I can't see the logic in their statement at all. 
Using basic economics and following the demand curve principle, then passenger numbers will fall.
That's forgetting that any traffic they're blaming, could get worse.

Imagine it being a bunch of people around a table with a job of 'What reason can we use which doesn't sound as bad as petrol prices and inflation' and that's the best which they came up with. Not particularly the best neither.

Nothing to do with having to fund Euro 6 mods, paying their staff in line with inflation and buying new buses then? Not to mention the fluctuating fuel prices which are bouncing up and down by 10p every so often...

As others have said, the majority of customers won't have a clue what Euro 6 is or means. I'd be surprised if the majority are interested in operational matters either.

Interested re: the comment on paying staff in line with inflation. Are you saying they're consistent at making pay offers either above or inline with inflation?

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Surely a business like Stagecoach have bought their fuel well in advance? Most if not all of the big operators hedge their fuel. 

However going back to the other points you raise, they might all be true. Except that isn't what SNE are telling the media. 
They're telling the media that traffic is causing issues and to counter that traffic, they're having to use extra buses. 

Source: https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/whats-on...e-17760592

We all know that raising prices isn't going to reduce the amount of traffic on the road. I would hazard a guess and say that it may have the opposite effect and increase traffic on the road.

Spot on. There's a lot of talk from operators at the moment about congestion and making buses (and public transport in general) more attractive to try and combat it, but I'm not sure what they hope to achieve by further pricing people away from it.

Stagecoach's operation in the North East is very much no-frills. They have a national model and they continue to make square pegs fit into round holes, wherever they look to operate. There's no attempt to even try and encourage people out of their car, unlike GNE for example, who have continued to innovate over a number of years and try new things. The new buses and spec on the X30, in my opinion, being a really good example.

Its going to take more than just the local authority and Government to help combat congestion. The real challenge starts at the operators doors.

Stagecoach's operation in the North East is very much no-frills. They have a national model and they continue to make square pegs fit into round holes, wherever they look to operate. There's no attempt to even try and encourage people out of their car, unlike GNE for example, who have continued to innovate over a number of years and try new things. The new buses and spec on the X30, in my opinion, being a really good example.

Not sure that's a fair statement.  If the offer of new buses on the X30 is a really good example from GNE, how are the similarly spec'd similarly new buses Stagecoach have just bought for the 39 & 40 demonstrating no attempt to even try?

Not sure that's a fair statement.  If the offer of new buses on the X30 is a really good example from GNE, how are the similarly spec'd similarly new buses Stagecoach have just bought for the 39 & 40 demonstrating no attempt to even try?

Not sure it is unfair either. Perception of marketing perhaps?

Stagecoach have done very little to promote these features and look very “no frills” compared to Go North East’s similar buses.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not sure it is unfair either. Perception of marketing perhaps?

Stagecoach have done very little to promote these features and look very “no frills” compared to Go North East’s similar buses.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There's no doubt the Stagecoach route branding is incredibly dull though I believe it was stated that this was due to the impending launch of the (insipid) new livery.

That aside, the features are advertised on the sides and rear of the buses, and on board leaflets.  I guess whether one livery or brand looks better than another is always highly subjective.  There was also a central Newcastle launch, which arguably did more to promote awareness in terms of passing footfall on Northumberland Street, than the X30 launch would have enjoyed at Tanfield Railway.

There's no doubt the Stagecoach route branding is incredibly dull though I believe it was stated that this was due to the impending launch of the (insipid) new livery.

That aside, the features are advertised on the sides and rear of the buses, and on board leaflets.  I guess whether one livery or brand looks better than another is always highly subjective.  There was also a central Newcastle launch, which arguably did more to promote awareness in terms of passing footfall on Northumberland Street, than the X30 launch would have enjoyed at Tanfield Railway.

Slightly unpopular, but I actually don't mind the new Stagecoach livery. It's simple, using easy on the eye colours and you're left in no doubt as to who the operator is. 

If you're standing in a bus stop, there's a huge Stagecoach logo on the front so passengers will be confident that they're getting on the correct bus. Remember also that for lots of people who live in places with multiple operators they may not be sure which company runs which route - or be told that they need to get the "insert operator name here" bus. 

If you look at the logos of Netflix, Google, airbnb, Deliveroo, Pepsi as some examples, you'll notice a move to a more simplistic, cleaner looking logo. More and more nowadays people associate minimalism with modern, forward facing companies. 

Further, the colours used internally on the new vehicles look and feel modern and up to date. Grey is a very neutral colour, and paired with a reasonably unoffensive blue it works well to create a calm interior. Contrast that with red, for example, which makes people feel more emotional - obvious upsides but also connotations of anger, something you don't want on a bus.

As others have said, the majority of customers won't have a clue what Euro 6 is or means. I'd be surprised if the majority are interested in operational matters either.

Interested re: the comment on paying staff in line with inflation. Are you saying they're consistent at making pay offers either above or inline with inflation?

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Spot on. There's a lot of talk from operators at the moment about congestion and making buses (and public transport in general) more attractive to try and combat it, but I'm not sure what they hope to achieve by further pricing people away from it.

Stagecoach's operation in the North East is very much no-frills. They have a national model and they continue to make square pegs fit into round holes, wherever they look to operate. There's no attempt to even try and encourage people out of their car, unlike GNE for example, who have continued to innovate over a number of years and try new things. The new buses and spec on the X30, in my opinion, being a really good example.

Its going to take more than just the local authority and Government to help combat congestion. The real challenge starts at the operators doors.

I don't think the spec currently being promoted on the X30 will be able to sustain itself as anything different in the not too distant future.
I genuinely think it (or at least the majority of it) will become the norm.

It's gonna be an interesting time for commercial and marketing depts as they come up with new ways to attract passengers.
I think we are seeing the slow decline of the route branding fad, data deals are getting better and battery life is lasting longer. Will there be any need for operators to spec these elements?

I am glad there was a re-jig of the GNE zoning structure. 
I'm glad there 24 hour ticket was introduced. 
Too little, too late? It's nearly the end of Feb, I've not used a UK bus since the second week in December and I'm an 'enthusiast'. 
What about 'ordinary' punters?

I don't think the spec currently being promoted on the X30 will be able to sustain itself as anything different in the not too distant future.
I genuinely think it (or at least the majority of it) will become the norm.

It's gonna be an interesting time for commercial and marketing depts as they come up with new ways to attract passengers.
I think we are seeing the slow decline of the route branding fad, data deals are getting better and battery life is lasting longer. Will there be any need for operators to spec these elements?

I am glad there was a re-jig of the GNE zoning structure. 
I'm glad there 24 hour ticket was introduced. 
Too little, too late? It's nearly the end of Feb, I've not used a UK bus since the second week in December and I'm an 'enthusiast'. 
What about 'ordinary' punters?

As many people have said already, everyone who NEEDS to travel by bus is already travelling by bus. Now they just need to try and persuade people out of cars. And one of the ways GNE are trying to do that (and I think they're succeeding, for the most part anyway) is making their buses as high spec as possible. While the novelty of the high spec will wear off for passengers in the not too distant future, for first time passengers I don't think it will, so even if it does become the norm, it will still stand out to their target audience.
Plus, with a few exceptions, the routes they are upgrading to X-Lines don't have any competition so those who need to use the bus, are already travelling GNE, so it's not a case of poaching passengers from other operators but from cars

I honestly can't remember the last time I used the on board WiFi, 100mb a day is nowhere near enough to be useful so I never bother connecting, plus when I have unlimited 4G that averages ~50mbps over the whole of the X21 route, there's no point.
As for the charging, every time I get on a bus with USB or Wireless charging I charge up my phone. It's a habit I got in to when the battery on my old phone wouldn't even last until lunch time. 

I still think there could be improvements to the GNE zoning, having more crossover would be a start. I particularly like what Arriva does with some of their zones, like allowing passengers with a Durham District ticket to travel all the way to Newcastle on the X12.

I don't think the spec currently being promoted on the X30 will be able to sustain itself as anything different in the not too distant future.
I genuinely think it (or at least the majority of it) will become the norm.

It's gonna be an interesting time for commercial and marketing depts as they come up with new ways to attract passengers.
I think we are seeing the slow decline of the route branding fad, data deals are getting better and battery life is lasting longer. Will there be any need for operators to spec these elements?

I am glad there was a re-jig of the GNE zoning structure. 
I'm glad there 24 hour ticket was introduced. 
Too little, too late? It's nearly the end of Feb, I've not used a UK bus since the second week in December and I'm an 'enthusiast'. 
What about 'ordinary' punters?

I've believed for quite a while that, bar a few key routes (including things like Airport routes), a strong corporate livery with minimal route branding is the way forward. Things like WiFi, USB sockets, NSAs are becoming standard spec, so going forward operators need to do a better job of marketing other benefits. 

Journey times, fares in comparison to parking, fuel, insurance etc, perks of using it on a night into town in comparison to driving is what they need to focus on moving forward. Daytime services, while passenger numbers will probably be slightly lower than they used to be, probably aren't the main issue - evening services using the same vehicles with substantially lower passenger numbers are. Essentially leisure users need to increase - that can only really be done with attractive fares.

Essentially leisure users need to increase - that can only really be done with attractive fares.

That's a good point, fares are attractive, and often considerably cheaper than car, as long as you're a regular user. But if you're just using the bus here and there, it does get quite pricey!

I think that's why they introduced the evening ticket, which at £6.50 for a group of 4 is actually a pretty good deal... as long as you actually get bus service on an evening!

That's a good point, fares are attractive, and often considerably cheaper than car, as long as you're a regular user. But if you're just using the bus here and there, it does get quite pricey!

There is a bus 30 seconds from my front door right to the Metrocentre. Because i own a car, it is not economical for me to get a bus as i simply dont spend £5.30 on fuel there and back, if i am with my partner then £10.60 is far too much!

The operators need to keep hold of people before they get a car at a young age, as no one is really going to spend on both, if you already have that outgoing of finance/insurance/tax, fuel is much cheaper than a bus ticket. 

When you add it all up, if i currently could get a bus to work, i would get rid of the car it would save me £200+ a month.

When i start at GNE we are going straight down to 1 car. It makes zero sense to have 2 when i do not need it for work. Even if i had to pay for the bus i would still get rid as its not economical to pay for both.

There is a bus 30 seconds from my front door right to the Metrocentre. Because i own a car, it is not economical for me to get a bus as i simply dont spend £5.30 on fuel there and back, if i am with my partner then £10.60 is far too much!

The operators need to keep hold of people before they get a car at a young age, as no one is really going to spend on both, if you already have that outgoing of finance/insurance/tax, fuel is much cheaper than a bus ticket. 

When you add it all up, if i currently could get a bus to work, i would get rid of the car it would save me £200+ a month.

When i start at GNE we are going straight down to 1 car. It makes zero sense to have 2 when i do not need it for work. Even if i had to pay for the bus i would still get rid as its not economical to pay for both.

For me, it makes no financial sense to drive, I live in Bishop Auckland, but regularly travel up to Newcastle, that return journey in a car averaging 38mpg (which is what our car gets) would cost about £9.50. I pay £95 a month for my All Zone ticket, so I only need to go to Newcastle and back 10 times in a month to break even. And that's before I take in to account the cost of insurance, which for a person my age would be in the hundreds a month, then there's the cost of a car, tax etc. Sure, it would be more convenient to drive, but for me it's not worth it. Plus, I have family at both ends if I need to get somewhere that's not on a bus route! 

I have a bus stop 30 seconds from my door to Newcastle, but it stops running at 6pm. If I want to travel later than that I have to get an Arriva bus to Bishop for £1.40 then use my GNE pass. Even taking that in to account, it's still miles cheaper to get the bus!

Plus, I could be paying only £68 a month as I'm under 25, but I'll happily pay the extra to use The Key over using the app!