Bank Holiday Services
#21
Moderation note: Discussion around bank holiday service provision has been moved here, as it's not operator specific. It also makes more sense to have one stream of conversation on the subject, rather than three. 
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#22
I wonder if the operators realise that, on days like these especially when it was warm, that they could have made a pile of cash by operating a Saturday timetable. The amount of posts I saw on Facebook complaining about the buses only running to a Sunday service was unreal.

The same applies to what we were talking about on Boxing Day, people don't stay at home that much anymore, as shops etc. are open, and people need to get to work...
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#23
It's good this thread exists as it gives me a place to vent when I find out that I will be stranded on Boxing Day again.

It is ridiculous how Arriva don't operate any routes on Boxing Day, I know it's a commercial risk but I still think some routes across the North East could run and potentially turn a profit, mainly routes on Tyneside and another route that could maybe do okay is the Sapphire 7.

In regards to other bank holidays I think more services are needed in places and I think some services can barely keep to a Sunday timetable on a Sunday never mind on a bank holiday. Also capacity seems to be problematic on some services, last year I rode a rammed Pulsar on the 5A from Darlington on one bank holiday Monday and on the August Bank Holiday Monday I rode the 21 to Peterlee on an EcoCity and that had very few seats left when it got towards Peterlee then jumped on a 24 to Sunderland and it had standees. I hope to dear God if the Enviro 400's have entered service I hope they are allocated to the 7 on May Day when I head to the MetroCentre as some of these journeys are busy enough on a Sunday never mind on a Bank Holiday.
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#24
I think companies (I'm looking at you here Arriva) need to realise that on Boxing Day people need to get to work, and people just don't stay at home anymore. The companies are stranding people who will need to pay an extortionate amount of money for a Taxi. 

Additionally, I'm sure Tyresmoke said something in the ANE thread on Friday about the amount of passengers being near a normal weekday??


(I'm under the impression that GNE and SNE operated Boxing Day services in 2014?)
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#25
I live in Seaburn and it was busy so I opted to get the Metro to Chichester. Slighly longer but couldn't be bothered waiting for E2 or E6. To give SNE a little bit of praise they day operate a normal Mon to Fri service from around 930am but it's not enough.

Regardless of wheather we are in the 21st century now. I do feel sorry getting the brunt of passengers grief, but they face the customers not the commercial department.

SNE did operate a special timetable on Boxing Day and not one bus I caught was on time due to very high passenger loadings. Again not the drivers fault, but powers a be.

I know several forum users disagreed with my post about services finishing early on NYE etc but it's about time we did. And no service on NYD when there is football matches on is just a disgrace. It's OK drivers saying we have family etc - but so do others that don't have a choice about working these 'bank' holidays. I say 'bank' as most people work.
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#26
(06/04/2015, 23:39)mb134 Wrote: I wonder if the operators realise that, on days like these especially when it was warm, that they could have made a pile of cash by operating a Saturday timetable. The amount of posts I saw on Facebook complaining about the buses only running to a Sunday service was unreal.

The same applies to what we were talking about on Boxing Day, people don't stay at home that much anymore, as shops etc. are open, and people need to get to work...

By operating a Saturday service would reduce the cash sum that was made today. Twice the expenditure dose not mean more profits. 
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#27
(07/04/2015, 01:00)roar Wrote: By operating a Saturday service would reduce the cash sum that was made today. Twice the expenditure dose not mean more profits.

Surely it is about planning and playing the long game though?

Invest in Bank Holiday services, run it well, promote it well and what may be quiet initially and not returning the levels seen on a normal working day, should see an increase into the future.
It is like when shops first opened on a Sunday. They were quiet initially, but gradually footfall increased and behaviours adapted.

People can only use what is offered and put in front of them.

It goes back to what you were saying about the industry lacking flair.
'Illegitimis non carborundum'
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#28
(07/04/2015, 07:34)Andreos1 Wrote: Surely it is about planning and playing the long game though?

Invest in Bank Holiday services, run it well, promote it well and what may be quiet initially and not returning the levels seen on a normal working day, should see an increase into the future.
It is like when shops first opened on a Sunday. They were quiet initially, but gradually footfall increased and behaviours adapted.

People can only use what is offered and put in front of them.

It goes back to what you were saying about the industry lacking flair.

I can only agree with you, cant see it happening unless it's forced though. Now we have AVL and the authorities have access to the running data we might see some changes as the percentage of services running late will be known. 

We have seen a little innovation over the last few years with poorly timed services being re-timed, this has resulted in a higher frequency on some core routes on a Sunday service with extra layover time added to allow a return service to depart on time, now that could sound like i'm defending the industry there but I'm not. I honestly cant see the point of giving 10-15 minutes layover because you know a service is going to be late and needs that time so your return journey departs on time. That time would be better put into your schedule meaning less pressure on the driver, customers making connections, customers not wondering if or when the service is going to turn up.

With my years in this industry its very disheartening to see how things are going, trouble is with this lack of flair, motivation and dedication the true bus men are now thinking let them get on with it I'm out in x amount of years. I believe the railway industry is seeing this decline too. 
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#29
(07/04/2015, 10:32)roar Wrote: I can only agree with you, cant see it happening unless it's forced though. Now we have AVL and the authorities have access to the running data we might see some changes as the percentage of services running late will be known. 

We have seen a little innovation over the last few years with poorly timed services being re-timed, this has resulted in a higher frequency on some core routes on a Sunday service with extra layover time added to allow a return service to depart on time, now that could sound like i'm defending the industry there but I'm not. I honestly cant see the point of giving 10-15 minutes layover because you know a service is going to be late and needs that time so your return journey departs on time. That time would be better put into your schedule meaning less pressure on the driver, customers making connections, customers not wondering if or when the service is going to turn up.

With my years in this industry its very disheartening to see how things are going, trouble is with this lack of flair, motivation and dedication the true bus men are now thinking let them get on with it I'm out in x amount of years. I believe the railway industry is seeing this decline too. 

Or, they're given cash incentives. I won't use 'subsidies, grants or handouts - cos eazypeazy doesn't like it. Wink

Granted a lot of the local opps are given a lot of autonomy by head offices, but is it worth certain departments taking the bigger risks?
Or are those departments capable of coming up with something that doesn't involve time away from computer programmes and spreadsheets?

Totally agree with the backloading of layover at the end of a route or in the case of the X35/36 half way through.
Haven't been able to identify a way of sticking it down in writing.

Getting back to the bank holiday issue though, until each and every passenger is questioned (or monitored) on their ultimate destination - there is no way their start and end point can be monitored (in the case of hub & spoke transferring between services).

Malarkey using a paper day/week ticket and travelling between Lambton and Seaburn, isn't monitored as a whole journey.
He joins the masses at Concord on a 56 and is one of many hopping on a E1 from the Wheatsheaf.
As far as operators can see, he is one of a couple using the 82, adds to the growing success story that the rebrand of the 4 has brought us, justifies deckers on the 56 and adds to the reasoning behind running a Saturday service on the E's.
What it doesn't tell the operators, is that a portion of those using the 4 and 56, would benefit from a direct bus from Washington to Seaburn.
Ground on feet and innovation would possibly suggest there was demand for a seasonal service.

As you said previously, running back and forth all day, would just bring empty vehicles back into Washington, until people were ready to come home - so let it run onto something else at the Seaburn end.
'Illegitimis non carborundum'
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#30
For the last three or so years, Stagecoach have run a Saturday service on bank holidays on the 100 but it's blindingly obvious that a Saturday service would be justified across the rest of the 'core' Newcastle network. But they are incredibly slow to react to changing travel patterns though. To take one of my local routes as an example, the Saturday and Sunday diagrams on the 22 have been far too tight for years and late running was the norm rather than the exception. They are reluctant to do anything because it would mean diagramming an extra bus or reducing frequencies (neither of which are Stagecoach hallmarks). It does look like there will (finally) be some changes at the end of May (brought forward from the original date of the end of August as suggested at the recent open meeting).
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#31
SC in Sunderland has increased the PVR of #23 on Sundays, and has extended it to Morrisons so it doesn't have such a long layover. I also believe since the frequency increase on Sundays on most services during the day increased to every 20 minutes has been well recieved to, although I most admit I don't use them much at all. Pretty much use the E services, 18/19 and 23 only. This is because any futher I normally take my van.
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#32
The X1 I've used has left Gateshead actually full to capacity. Both on the seating and standing front. It was a similar story in the Metrocentre interchange, where you had queues of folk waiting for buses on every stand.

It actually feels more of a Saturday in terms of people out, how busy the Metrocentre was, cars on the road and so on.
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#33
SC tweeting about delays due to customer demand as well as traffic. When will service levels be upped?!?!
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#34
I had a look at the ANE Live Map earlier on (about 11/12), and all buses from Ashington to Blyth into Newcastle looked late, with a few not being tracked. A few X21/22's were a good 10 minutes late, as was a 35 at some point (interworks with the X21). Demand is obviously there, why aren't (some Wink ) operators acting? 

Have to agree with aureolin's point, regarding it feeling like a Saturday, maybe some happy medium could be found between the two to start off with?
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#35
(04/05/2015, 18:42)idiot Wrote: SC tweeting about delays due to customer demand as well as traffic. When will service levels be upped?!?!

We don't live in 1955 anymore, we have places to go, things to do, jobs and all that is limited (or doesn't happen at all) due to Sunday service on normal days.

The demand on service X21/22 in Ashington on bank holidays delays buses, mb134 reported a bus that I saw depart on time, running 10 minutes late further along the route.
Tom | omnicity4659.co.uk  

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#36
(04/05/2015, 18:42)Jimmi Wrote: Thankfully I have just and I mean just caught the 7 in Durham so I won't be making a complaint.

Those of you in Tyne and Wear who have a regular bus and Metro service on a Sunday should be very grateful for it as I have one bus an hour to Durham on a Sunday and it doesn't connect with anything, hence why I never bothered getting Coast and Country photos yesterday as I would have out for 4 hours to get one photo in Chester-le-Street.

(04/05/2015, 18:49)Tommy_1581 Wrote: I dont have a regular bus service. Just the 1 to Blyth/Ashington hourly and X21 to Newcastle/Newbiggin hourly.

Two buses an hour during 0900-1800, none of my journeys sparkle on Sundays as the 1 is more conveniently timed.

Think about poor me with one bus every 2 hours here! First one to Hexham 0940, first one to Carlisle 1025...


Really, really enjoyed the rally. Thanks to all involved from NEBPT, GNE etc. Spot on show!
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#37
(04/05/2015, 18:55)northern156 Wrote: Think about poor me with one bus every 2 hours here! First one to Hexham 0940, first one to Carlisle 1025...

We are all jealous of your excellent service  Tongue
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#38
(04/05/2015, 18:55)northern156 Wrote: Think about poor me with one bus every 2 hours here! First one to Hexham 0940, first one to Carlisle 1025...

Or me. Housebound for two days straight over xmas, thanks to Arriva having an extra day in bed! 
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#39
(04/05/2015, 18:52)mb134 Wrote: I had a look at the ANE Live Map earlier on (about 11/12), and all buses from Ashington to Blyth into Newcastle looked late, with a few not being tracked. A few X21/22's were a good 10 minutes late, as was a 35 at some point (interworks with the X21). Demand is obviously there, why aren't operators acting? 

Have to agree with aureolin's point, regarding it feeling like a Saturday, maybe some happy medium could be found between the two to start off with?

I would have Saturday start/finish times then have Mon-Fri running times between 1000-1500 then reduced frequency upto 2000, then a couple of services after that for convenience of later finishers. 
Tom | omnicity4659.co.uk  

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#40
(04/05/2015, 18:52)mb134 Wrote: I had a look at the ANE Live Map earlier on (about 11/12), and all buses from Ashington to Blyth into Newcastle looked late, with a few not being tracked. A few X21/22's were a good 10 minutes late, as was a 35 at some point (interworks with the X21). Demand is obviously there, why aren't operators acting? 

Have to agree with aureolin's point, regarding it feeling like a Saturday, maybe some happy medium could be found between the two to start off with?

Add "some" to that!

Go North East were running the X66 with what appeared to be 6 vehicles today, opposed to the normal Sunday PVR of 4. Two Streetlites (one at the rally and another one VOR), two Versas and two Scania L94s. I believe there are also earlier and later journeys on the X88? I may be wrong on that one, though.

As I posted in the GNE Latest section earlier, "Whey Aye Five 0" 50A is operated with double deckers (which are probably not as fuel-efficient) on a bank holiday now, too, opposed to the usual branded single deck Scania OmniCitys. Obviously not ideal as the brand identity is lost somewhat, but it's better than leaving people behind or having buses packed to the rafters making an uncomfortable journey...
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