Bus Services Bill
#21
Be careful who you choose as Mayor:-
Quote:The Mayor will have responsibility for determining which bus services should be provided.
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#22
More here:- 
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/sy...ummary.pdf
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#23
(03/06/2016, 23:41)G-CPTN Wrote: Be careful who you choose as Mayor:-

Given that all bar two seats in the North East are held by Labour MPs, I think the contest is going to be more about which candidate Labour select. Hennig and Forbes are dead certs in my opinion, but I think the two PCCs and possibly Bridget Phillipson, will put their names such forward.

The less we say about Hexham and Berwick electing a Tory, the better... Smile
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#24
(04/06/2016, 00:04)Adrian Wrote: Given that all bar two seats in the North East are held by Labour MPs, I think the contest is going to be more about which candidate Labour select. Hennig and Forbes are dead certs in my opinion, but I think the two PCCs and possibly Bridget Phillipson, will put their names such forward.

The less we say about Hexham and Berwick electing a Tory, the better... Smile

That name appears every where on this fourm.. Haha

I haven't really took notice of this bus bill, so can't say what i think...
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#25
(03/06/2016, 23:41)G-CPTN Wrote: Be careful who you choose as Mayor:-

I don't know why the Quote has disappeared, but in the Summaries I've read and presentation I've seen, I don't think its strictly true.

The Elected Mayor will have the ultimate decision as to whether to go ahead with Franchising (or another option) and may very well have ultimate responsibility. However, the services themselves will be drawn up by the Local Transport Authority, and be subject to some level of "public" consultation.

You are perfectly right in saying "Be careful" though, as I'm sure the North East has its share of Bus hating (and therefore Bus *user* hating) politicians, just as Greater Manchester has.
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#26
(04/06/2016, 21:37)Tamesider Wrote: I don't know why the Quote has disappeared, but in the Summaries I've read and presentation I've seen, I don't think its strictly true.

The Elected Mayor will have the ultimate decision as to whether to go ahead with Franchising (or another option) and may very well have ultimate responsibility. However, the services themselves will be drawn up by the Local Transport Authority, and be subject to some level of "public" consultation.

You are perfectly right in saying "Be careful" though, as I'm sure the North East has its share of Bus hating (and therefore Bus *user* hating) politicians, just as Greater Manchester has.

The issue is though, there is no longer a 'local transport authority' as such, as far as Tyne and Wear or even the North East goes. Transport is a devolved matter to NECA, and the lead for Transport (Nick Forbes at present) would report directly to the mayor. It's always going to remain party political, unless an independent gets in.
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#27
Had a look through and i kind of like this, most buses these days already have WIFI etc so its no different, it'll be interesting to see who gets elected.
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#28
North East Mayor: Who are the likely candidates to run for the title?
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#29
(05/06/2016, 13:01)G-CPTN Wrote: North East Mayor: Who are the likely candidates to run for the title?

For gods sake not Paul Watson, look at that smug face, known he is part of the problem, Sunderland has attracting decent businesses etc, wonder how much has gone in his back pockets over the years instead of the city....

Destroyed the city, waste land everywhere, complete dump....
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#30
(05/06/2016, 12:11)Michael Wrote: Had a look through and i kind of like this, most buses these days already have WIFI etc so its no different, it'll be interesting to see who gets elected.

Hmm! Not sure wi-fi is the most important issue! Whether a service exists; how frequent, reliable, affordable and accessible are surely far more important.
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#31
(05/06/2016, 13:01)G-CPTN Wrote: North East Mayor: Who are the likely candidates to run for the title?


I mentioned Vera Baird's name a few weeks back.
Hopefully the Chronicle voting is representative of any actual vote.
'Illegitimis non carborundum'
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#32
Bus Services Bill 2nd reading going through House of Lords now:
http://services.parliament.uk/bills/2016...tages.html


Lord Whitty (Labour) making some very good points in response to the reading (Timed, starting at 16:52 on Parliament TV link)
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#33
Bumpy ride ahead as bus firms struggle to keep a firm hand on the wheel

Read more: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016...and-on-th/
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#34
(12/06/2016, 14:33)Dan Wrote: Bumpy ride ahead as bus firms struggle to keep a firm hand on the wheel

Read more: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016...and-on-th/

Interesting article.

A lot of the debate against QCS focused around the reason being to 'prop the Metro up'. If there's a need to legislate something like this, and by a Conservative government of all people, it shows that what we have is far from ideal.

Why change something that isn't broken after all.
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#35
(12/06/2016, 15:34)Adrian Wrote: Interesting article.

A lot of the debate against QCS focused around the reason being to 'prop the Metro up'. If there's a need to legislate something like this, and by a Conservative government of all people, it shows that what we have is far from ideal.

Why change something that isn't broken after all.

The problem is - as with most "political" arguments (including the EU referendum) - its beginning to look like another case of many people being the proverbial Turkeys being asked to choose between Thanksgiving and Christmas. As such, it often interesting to compare notes between different conurbations, albeit being careful to note differences in car ownership levels; areas of depravity (economic, health etc); existing travel patterns/choices etc, and whether Bus Operators and Politicians treat all their customers/tax-payers equally.

In Greater Manchester, Deregulation faiiled bus users so dramatically, one (then) leading Tory, Steven Norris, even admitted as much. Patronage collapsed by nearly 30% in the first year, and the standard of competition has been generally very poor and totally lacking innovation - no genuine fare cuts or service enhancements apart from a few isolated examples in the western half of the conurbation. Things slowly stabilised during the "noughties", and when First announced general fare cuts about 4 years ago, and then the worst of the "cowboy" Operators finally disappeared, it seemed like things were about to change. Unfortunately, it was a false dawn as the combination of EYMS selling Finglands to First and Stagecoach changing Management has lead to a bus war between south Manchester and Swinton/Little Hulton (beyond Salford) with both First and Stagecoach happy to inflict "casualties" throughout their traditional, low car ownership territories across the north and east of the conurbation; by way of service cuts; a further increase in the level of timetable changes and an acceptance of declining punctuality outside the Manchester city boundary - especially in the Evenings and on Sunday mornings when service levels are sparse, and (comparitively speaking) so is traffic congestion. It has also left a big gap in fares; Taking Stagecoach as an example on the competing routes that have increased point to point buses from 12+ to 18+ an hour (off-peak) , a 6 mile journey from Swinton to Manchester costs £1.20; wheras where I live a 0.8 mile journey in a poor area costs £1.90 and has seen a reduction from 10 to 8 buses per hour. Further down the route (into Stockport), the service cuts have been more severe.
In summary, if the Buses Bill had been announced in the 2012 or 2013 Queens' Speech, then the Operators could have made a very good case against the principle. Now, they have demonstrated they can not be trusted to serve the vast majority of the 31% of Greater Manchester's adults without regular access to a car.

OTOH, the record of Greater Manchester's politicians where buses are concerned is not good. Apart from the completion of the M60, the change in liicencing laws and the constant drop (in real terms) in the cost of *running* a car - all of which Local Authorities can't be blamed for; GM's politicians have damaged the lives of bus passengers by banning cross-city services in 1995; changing School hours more dramatically than the rest of the UK; refusing to enforce the prohibition against bus stop blocking and of course, the expansion of Rail - especially Light Rail into (for now!) low car ownership areas.

And it is probably this last one, where a comparison with Tyne & Wear is most appropriate. I was last in the North East in late 2012 and travelled on the Metro from South Shields to Newcastle. As I was not making any bus journeys that day, I don't know what "integrated" Bus/Metro fares are like. However, I think there was a significant time saving, and the Metro had comfortable seats despite it being an early 4xxx series unit number - which I assume was the same batch from my previous visit to Newcastle a good twenty years earlier. Are they due for replacement.
I don't suppose I need to give a detailed history of Metrolink to most readers here, but for the younger ones in particular, it seems its role has changed somewhat. The first line, opened almost a quarter of a century ago, was a straight rail replacement line from Bury to Altrincham crossing Manchester city centre from Victoria, through Shudehill (then Arndale Centre), Market Street, Piccadilly Gardens and St.Peter's Square. A large proportion of areas served are high car ownership areas and the time savings compared to buses were significant, even then. Nevertheless, it did lead to the loss of direct buses to Manchester for some estates above Whitefield (near Bury) and evening/SundayNight bus cuts on the main route to Altrincham. Further expansion took in Eccles - although the only tangible benefit was to serve Salford Quays; Chorlton/Wythenshawe/M'cr Airport (where local Councillors supporting it denied the very existance of - then, 16 buses an hour between Wythenshawe and the Airport; Oldham/Rochdale - which according to some surveys has led to house *deflation* even worse than the county average - and Ashton-under-Lyne, which is the most direct competitor to the bus industry of all, not least because there is NO off-peak time saving between Tameside's lborough seat and Piccadilly. Additionally, the original grey/green trams with tolerable seating, have now been replaced by "yellow perils" fitted solely with bum perches every bit as bad as wheelarch seats on Enviro 400s.
Reactive bus service cuts have been slow thus far. However, Arriva have started reducing their services between the Airport and the various parts of Wythenshawe (a massive housing estate); First are about to cut back most remaining commercial services between Rochdale and Chaddeton/Moston/Oldham Road (24/181/182) to just run between Shaw and Manchester, as well as halving the Rushcroft/Shaw to Manchester service through Middleton (59), and Stagecoach are systematically reducing the 216 along Ashton New Road that shadows the tram for about 90% of the route, as well as halving the Littlemoss/Sunnyside-Manchester 231 service, which formed the heart of the well-known Maynes of Manchester network for most of the 20th Century.
I had heard that TFGM/C had (quite rightly) pointed to overbussing of city routes such as the 38 & 192, in contrast to the ever declining services outside of Mancheser/Salford. Noting that the eastern boroughs of Stockport, Tameside and Oldham in particular, have large areas of low car ownership - many on "overspill" estates - and these communities have effectively cross-subsidised the city dwellers and the compartively richer south and west of GM for best part of a century. Unfortunately, the press cutting from Dr. Lamonte (NOT featured anywhere in the local media, btw) does hint at the old adage "Be careful what you wish for....."
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#36
(12/06/2016, 19:28)Tameside Wrote: ... areas of depravity....
Don't you mean "areas of depravation..."

Depravity is something entirely different... although, you are talking about Manchester...!!! Big Grin
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#37
http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/nort...p-11622700

Bus Bill gets a mention in The Chronicle.

As a side. Which of the two B5's is on the right stand?
'Illegitimis non carborundum'
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#38
(15/07/2016, 23:01)Andreos1 Wrote: http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/nort...p-11622700

Bus Bill gets a mention in The Chronicle.

As a side. Which of the two B5's is on the right stand
I agree to be honest. That clause shouldn't be there, because when operators decide a service can't be ran commercially, it'd give NECA the ability to run it in house instead. 30 years of deregulation shows that to be an issue.
And the one furthest away is in the correct stand I think!
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#39
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37089246

Corbyn to give powers to local authorities.
'Illegitimis non carborundum'
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#40
Quote:Mr Corbyn will promise to expand bus services to areas not currently covered, to give councils franchising powers over their bus networks, and to allow them to set up "municipal bus companies".

Mr Corbyn claims the moves would save money that could be used to reverse government cuts to local bus services.
How on Earth can you 'save money' by setting up companies to expand bus services to areas not currently covered?

Are there untapped revenues out there that the current private companies are ignoring?
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